Senosides

Senosides are the active ingredients such OTC laxatives as Smooth Move herbal tea, ExLax, and others. I have not experimented much with the teas and wonder if any members have given this a try?

If you have the tea at night, especially if you use two or three tea bags to make a pint or so of strong tea, I promise you will have a series of loose BMs in the morning, with some cramping that will clean you out.

For some reason, they also tend to be stinky. open a window and turn on the fan.

Senosides are also effective rectally. Senokot used to market a Senna Suppository. It worked slowly (1-2 hours), so a small retention enema containing senosides in a laxative dose is also very effective, and works more quickly than oral senosides (oral senosides usually take 6-8 hours to kick-in).

Senoside based products do tend to produce cramps. Senosides are in fact glucosides that reduce the frequency of peristalic muscles contractions in the bowel, but increase the force of the contractions, leading to the cramping activity and the more rapid propulsion of bowel contents.

If you would have a coffee enema in the morning it is very usefull to take an Exlax or two before bedtime. Then you can visit the batroom before you take the coffee enema and you able to hold the coffee as long as you want.

I've used senna tablets for constipation before I got back into enemas. They were always very effective. I started to try the tea to see where it could fit into my routine. I've found that sometimes I am nauseous after drinking the tea, especially two or three bags. Often severe boosting occurs too. The resulting purging feels great, with the cramps and peristalsis, but the nausea isn't. Anyone else experience this?

Lucy LeBeau dieter's tea is another one using senosides.

Matheww50 describes the issue being discussed very well. I'll paraphrase his comment some ".....and the more rapid propulsion of bowel contents." Very polite Mat! And excellent description.

I've use Smooth Move herbal tea, two bags steeped until cooled. I drank it as tea in the evening at bedtime. I did not sleep much. I felt the tea move from my very Right side to my far Left side with lots of cramping of course. What an experience that was! I had intervals of six trips to the bathroom with "rapid propulsion of bowel content." I was very cleaned out, but I had to work for it. I so enjoy enemas for pleasure and good health. Coffee enemas are great also.

Smooth Move herbal tea is true to its name. I would however change the Smooth Move name to "rapid propulsion." I love enemas best.

Here in Germany Senosides are regarded as dangerous for there exist the suspicion that they will give risk to cancer and that they will reduce the fertility.

I buy senna leaves and cascara sagrada bark at a local herbalist, grind them on a mortat & pestle, and brew a quart of very strong (almost black) tea. Although it is rather pleasing when sweetened with honey, I find it much more thorough (compelling, actually) when taken rectally. I suggest using a balloon or double balloon nozzle to aid in retaining it as long as possible. Hope you like cramps! If you can tough it out for 30 minutes or longer, you will be rewarded with an explosive BM! I suggest walking to the loo with the nozzle still inflated and sitting before deflating the inner balloon! The longer you hold it, the more laxative leaches into your bloodstream, and you will be rewarded with several follow-on BM's, possibly resulring in what I refer to as "dry heaves of the anus". A large salt & baking soda rinse helps to relieve the situation, but be prepared to stay home for the day when doing this. Oh, if you just want a good overnight workout, try drinking a cup of the tea and honey. It's tasty, pleasant, and thorough.

Matthew, or others: how do senosides compare with bisacodyl enemas for effectiveness?

The question is not as simple as it may seem. Bisacodyl loses the two acetate groups almost on contact with colonic contents, releasing the drug responsible for Bisacodyl's effectiveness as a laxative. Senosides need to be degraded by the Intestinal Flora in a two step process to produce Rhein which is responsible for Senna laxative effect. Compared to Bisacodyl, this happens very slowly. Consequently the time for a senoside based enema to take effect is typically something between 30 minutes and 2 hours. Ultimately on a milligram for milligram basis senosides are about 1/4 the potency of bisacodyl. For example six 5mg bisacodyl tables are used for complete emptying. When Senna was used (X-Prep), the dose of senosides varied somewhat from market to market, but ranged from about 125mg to 145 mg for complete emptying.

Thanks Matthew, I knew if anyone could answer my question, you could.

Now that phenolphthalein is unavailable as a laxative, due to a false report of possible cancer cases in the 1990s, Senosides, a senna extract has replaced it as the only tablet form alternative to bisacodyl.

One of the reasons I'm told that my mother used phenolphthalein was that it went to work faster, but kept working longer than bisacodyl. It would start working in a couple of hours and keep working all day, as opposed to bisacodyl, which takes 4 or 5 hours to kick in, and has done it's thing in an hour.

Senna is great if you enjoy waves of cramps and strong urgency... Pills like exlax I find ok for a more or less gentle or drastic nudge, for a total loss of control nothing like x-prep bowel evacuant (about 6-8 exlax pills in syrup form).

On the other hand, most treated sennoside drugs and blended teas (such as smooth move) do mix senna with other products to minimize cramps and harshness... best recipe for a big bowel upheaval is to buy the raw herb or teabags containing 100% senna. 2-3 mugs and chances are you'll be messy about 7 hours later.

I used X-Prep a half dozen times some years ago and liked it better than any laxative I have tried since but it does not seem to be available any more. Is if possible to get the same action out of, say, a half dozen senna based tablets? Or does someone know of a source for X-Prep?

X-prep was discontinued several years ago. The formula varies a little from country to country, but typically X-prep contains about 150mg of Sennosides. That corresponds to

17 Senokot® or Senokot-S® tablets or generic equivalent (8.6mg each)

9 Senekot® Double Strenght Tablets (17.2 mg each)

10 Ex-lax® squares (15 mg each) or equivalent

6 Maximum Strength Ex-Lax® or Equate®

For those who have not experienced X-prep it was advertised a 'single dose bowel evacuant'. In other words a single dose is supposed to leave you 'squeaky clean inside'. It didn't quite do so, but for purposes of X-ray examinations like Barium Enemas or IVP's, it left the bowel clean as far as an X-ray was concerned.

I have seen some Colonscopy prep regimens that call for 6 maximum strength Ex-Lax tablets, followed in about 12 hours by second round of 6 maximum strength Ex-lax tablets.

At this dose, some degree of cramping is to be epected with each dose, and 'results' can be expected in 4-8 hours.

Hope that is helpful.

Here in Germany all the senosides are suspected to cause cancer and infertility.

Thanks mattheww50. I liked the way X-prep worked and will try one of you alternatives someday. I don't do laxatives often so at once a year or whatever I suspect any cancer risk is pretty small if anything. I found in the few times I used it that X-Prep was quite quick acting (maybe 3 hrs on an empty stomach), very decisive, and not runny as I have found castor oil to be. It will be interesting to try a similar recipe.

Personally have never used them; I see a lot of patients who use them though, mainly to counteract narcotic medications and a lot of oncology drugs that cause severe constipation.

Thanks mattheww50 for the details. X-Prep was made right here where I live in Columbus, by the Warren-Teed Labs. As a drug rep., I used to see samples of it all over doctor's offices in central Ohio. It slowly died out and so did Warren-Teed Labs, but they made many other pharmaceutical products. Their literature pushed it as a far more acceptable prep. for BaE's than multiple enemas and castor oil.

Sunday morning I had to go to a brunch and eat to be sociable. I didn’t really want to eat so afterward I stopped at a health food store and bought some Lucy LeBeau dieter's tea. Each tea bag contains 1800 mg of senna leaf and some other herbs. Stopping at a gas station I took a 12 ounce cup and filled it half way with almost boiling water and steeped a single tea bag in it for 4 minutes, the instructions said 2 minutes but this did not seem long enough to me. Then I was on my way and when the tea cooled enough to sip I tasted it, not bad at all with the stevia leaf in the tea. When the tea was almost gone and I decided that I had enough and I dumped the dregs out the door at a stop light. It is now 11:15 AM.

The package said “works in 2 to 6 hours” and “take at bed time.” Well I have 10 or 11 hours before my bed time, it should easily work before then. OK bed time is here and nothing has happened, maybe I got normal tea and there is nothing to “diet tea.” Wrong, as soon as I lay down in a quite bed I could feel and hear my stomach gurgling. I spent an almost sleepless night and my tummy was bum by morning but still no BM. Anyway the diet part is working; I don’t even want to look at food. About 9 AM Monday the sennosides kicked in and I had my BM followed by diarrhea. The way my gut feels is, if I eat anything it is just going to drop out of ass in short order. It is going on 11 PM Monday and my lower works are starting to feel that they are going to hold.

Questions: How much sennoside did I get from the senna leaf? Internet searches say senna leaf ranges from 2 to 6 percent sennosides A + B. That is 36 to 108 mg of active ingredient. How much leached out of the tea bag in four minutes? The only way to know would be to steep another bag and discard the tea after 4 minutes and drink the tea made from the used bag. I am not going to be doing that soon. A senna colonoscopy prep using 130 mg of sennosides sounds like it causes a whole lot more diarrhea than I had so I would have to assume that it ether takes longer than four minutes to steep most of the sennosides out of the leaf or it was closer to a 2 percent concentration in the leaf.

Does anyone have experience using diet tea or senna leaf?

OK, I have read all the warning about using senna, don’t use it for more than 7 to 14 days. This was an experiment and it is not worth having a bum tummy just to stay away from food. I am not going to get into this stuff more than once, every several weeks.

Thanks for sharing any knowledge,

Barb

One time i was very sick as a toddler of 2 and i hadnt pooped in a week or 2. The doctor injected an iv laxative into me. I was filling up a diaper in about 5 minutes. It seemed like i was pooping for 15 munutes

Senna Tea

I went back and read the instructions... I was only to drink 1/2 of the tea I made, so I got about 30 mg of sennasides. That explains the diarrhea and the feeling that if I ate anything it was going to just go straight through me. My reading tells me that this is how a strong dose of senna is supposed to feel and I REALLY miss that feeling. One could easily get hooked on this stuff! I am going to put the remaining tea in the garbage, but I haven't done that yet.

Other reading: Senna contains 1.5 to 2 percent sennasides in the leaves and not 2 to 6 percent.

One prep for a colonoscopy (found on the web) is to take 144mg of sennasides on an empty stomach, drink at least 2 liters of water over the next few hours and repeat the 144mg of sennasides with water after 6 to 8 hours after the first dose. It would be best to drink Pediolite to replace electrolytes if you don't want to die. I did get this from a real doctor's web site. Also expect moderate to sever cramps. Then, two hours before your appointment, drink a bottle of mag citrate.

Smooth Move capsules (Danger this is deceptive and I am glad I did not do this to myself)

http://www.traditionalmedicinals.com/products/smooth-move-capsules/

Smooth Move® Senna capsules provide gentle, overnight relief from occasional constipation in a convenient vegetable capsule form.* A single serving (4 capsules) provides an effective dose of sennosides from senna leaf extract, a proven stimulant laxative. You have to go to a different web page to see that each capsule is 34.4 mg of sennasides. That's 137.6 mgs of sennasides.

Comment anyone?

Senosides have only really been used since phenolphthalein became illegal for laxative use. Some minimal cancer risk.

I went through what I believe was the very last of Mom's stuff several years ago, there was actually a cash register tape from a now-defunct chain store that was for something like a 48 count pack of "Extra Strength" generic,store brand phenolphthalein tablets (I later found out that 2 of the extra-strength tablets,and 3 regular strength tablets would have given you the same dose. Dad said he never knew the details but she always seemed to have the extra-strength on her, and was going through it too fast to be taking what he describes as "reasonable doses" This would have been right around the time eating disorders were starting to come into the public consciousness. Maybe she was by no means alone, and that was a factor in why they outlawed it!!

Senosides have in fact been around and in use for a very long time, however the dose was described in terms of the crude drug (senna) for most of that period. Senokot has been around for at least 50 years, Castoria probably more like 100 years. Senokot used to also exist a liquid and granules that could be mixed or sprinkled on food. The issue tended to be cost. Senokot was much more expensive than Ex--Lax or any of the other phenolphthalein based products. It wasn't that senna was really more expensive, it was the high margins to support the huge advertising campaign to doctors and greed. As for the safety, any competent organic chemist will tell you from just looking at Phenolpthalein structure, that they would not be surprised if it turned out to be carcinogen. I spent a decade in the Pharmaceutical business. We had a widely used prescription drug that I won't name (because it is still in wide use) that many chemists were highly suspicious of. It was eventually established that there was good reason to be suspicious (we dragged our feet on the testing and publishing for many year to delay the inevitable), and the product now carries a warning, although significantly 'watered down' from what it should be. My point here is that there is often very good reason to be suspicious of certain compounds. With Phenolphthalein, it is more the impurities than the Phenolphthalein that are of greater concern. Drugs in the US used a version called Yellow Phenolphthalein. the yellow (almost green) tint was a result of several impurities that greatly increased the effectiveness of the drug as a laxative. Pure Phenolphthalein is a white powder, and only about 1/4 the potency as a laxative that Yellow Phenolphthalein is.

Jimmyt144: bisacodyl is slower acting, but once it goes off, it is pretty much a "bowel bomb" especially on an empty stomach.

X-Prep was 2.5 liquid ounces or 75 ml or 15 tea spoons (15 * 8.8mg = 132 mg)

If you look for "Senna Liquid Syrup Natural Vegetable Laxative 8 oz", Active ingredients: Sennosides 8.8mg (in each teaspoon), on the shelf or on line you are going to have the same thing as X-Prex but at a much lower price.

A little over a week ago I bought a box of Lucy LeBeau dieter's tea, made a cup of tea and was rewarded with diarrhea and an unhappy tummy. Not an enjoyable way to diet but I just about stopped eating for a day and one half. OK, I said this stuff is going in the garbage because I'm going to get hooked on it as it is strangely compelling.

The tea bags are in the garbage and gone from the house but while looking at the small tea bags with just a little bit on tea in them I took one and steeped another six ounce cup for about 15 minutes. This cup I took as an enema to get things over quickly. After injecting the tea in my rectum I sat on a rolled up dish towel and sat at the computer while time passed and waited for urges to start. Nothing, except after about 40 minutes my ears began to ring and I was light headed, time to get the tea out of me. I went to the toilet and pushed a little, nothing came out. When I realized that I had adsorbed all six ounces of the tea I literally said under my breath, "Ahh SHhhit!" In about another 15 minutes all the contents of my bowels just dropped out of me. However, I was still light headed and didn't feel real good. This was worse than drinking the tea, I had diarrhea the following three days, lost another night of sleep and stayed off my feed. I don't have any more of this stuff in the house and I am not going to buy any more.

Think about this from an evolutionary perspective: A grazing animal comes along and eats some senna leaves and seed pods. The evil stuff keeps it up and keeps it moving, off its feed (saving the plant) and then it has diarrhea. So the seed pods are spread far and even fertilized when deposited. The animal may find it compelling to go back for another bite, so to speak, at another time.

This last summer I was at a nature center and saw a wonderful example of a Senna plant. My first thought was to grab a branch to strip the leaves off, stuff them into my purse and make some tea later. With my husband next to me this would not have gone well, so the plant remains intact.

Enough said,

Barb

Sometime I use x prep, but i don't love it because is slow an imprevedible acting.