Adults talking together

My remembrance of childhood examinations by physicians is... that it was a lot of talking between mom and the physician and that I was not really kept informed of things.

The best example of this is the digital rectal exams that I received on suspicion of appendicitis - the GP (and then later the surgeon) did not even bother to tell me I was about to get a finger up the bum ! (I think the GP had asked my mom for vaseline, so she probably had told her 'toucher rectal' but at that age I of course did not know what it meant.)

Another example: at the pharmacy, my mom was buying suppositories for me, so the person at the desk asked another one in the shelves in the back of the pharmacy, very loudly "Hey do you have FOOBAR CHILD SUPPOSITORIES??". So anybody in the pharmacy could hear, including the little girl from my school in tow of her mother waiting in line. I bet they don't dare do that for medicine bought for adults.

And my mom did not shy away from discussing my medical conditions with family members and friends, including embarrassing ones.

So to me one part of the humiliation about going to the doctors or the pharmacy as a child was basically adults talking about my conditions in front of me without bothering about my feelings. ;-)

Yes, I have many memories of the pediatrician talking to my mom while examining me, almost as if I wasn't even in the room. Even then I remember it being rather demeaning and adds to the embarrassment of being on display and treated like a child that has no say in the matter. Now of course it is a bit of a turn on and like to incorporate it in play exams for sure!

Oh yes, I have also a lot of those memories, because my mom was like an open book and talked to everyone who asked her about me, also to other mothers when we were waiting in the waiting room of the paediatrician, dermatologist or at the clinic, and naturally to other relatives, friends, but also to my teachers and the school secretaries, and she often told in detail about my history and problems, so that I was always ashamed about it and didn´t like that at all.

I think it's the same for most people; I certainly remember being talked over.

Probably the time I was most offended was about 11 or 12 when the surgeon asked my mother "Does he know when he needs to go to the toilet?", as if I was either incontinent, stupid, or otherwise unable to answer such a question myself.

I remember my mom talking to a catholic nun doctor while we were in Japan when I was a teenager. She told her all about my enema use. They started laughing and I ran outside in abject embarrassment.

Liquidsky: You, as a teenager, used enemas and your mom was aware of that? For what purpose? Did she approve or disapprove?

I remember the pediatrician talking to my mom about my development, etc. She even had my mom come over and look for herself

Supershooter: At one point, my mom got scared that I might have phimosis - my cousin had to be circumcised. So when auntie (my cousin's mother) visited she simply had me pull down my pants and briefs in front of her and auntie, and then they looked at the thing and she tried retracting the foreskin.

Even though I was used to lacking privacy with mom, this was a bit much. (Especially when I understood what had happened to my cousin and what thus risked befalling me.)

I remember that a lot when I was younger. The doctor would ask my mom questions ("Is Matthew eating all of his vegetables? Has he had any recent injuries?") or the nurse giving her instructions instead of me ("Have Matthew get undressed down to his underpants...") when I was perfectly capable of responding or complying myself.

I suspect that it got worse as I got older but in a different way. At around age 13, I asked my mom if I could go back by myself. She reluctantly agreed but on the condition that she could talk to the doctor afterwards about anything he might have found. This happened while I was getting dressed, probably back in the waiting room, so I have no idea what might have been said at that point.

I was a healthy and fit kid who played hockey. I do not really remember any significant conversations in private between my mother and Dr. Doom (he was really old and his ultimate cure all was a good leeching).When I was hitting puberty I was experiencing a developmental delay so I was referred to an Adolescent Medicine Specialist at a local children's hospital. (Yes they were around back then and I have a Cuneiform tablet to prove it). My doctor decided to keep me in the loop and made me understand the importance of self care.

Well when I was young cuneiform tablets were just replacing cave paintings.

My Mother would talk to the doctor many of times. When I reached puberty...I remember the doctor had me leave the exam room...outside the exam room were seats. I couldn't understand what they were saying...but I do remember the doctor advising my mother to do home inspection...I wasn't sure what that meant at the time...he also gave her 3 brochures I really didn't get to see them but I do remember the outside of the brochures were about teenage growth and development, Puberty in teen boys and some about Masturbation...I never got to see or read them as my mother was holding onto them as she left the room and then placed them into her pocket book...after that, I never seen them again, perhaps my mother through them into the garbage. I don't know what details the doctor and my mother spoke about but after that day, my mother was in the exam room watching the exams and at home she would inspect my genitals and I had to wear just my white brief undies around the house and to bed for sleep.

I remember once when I was 11 and going for a physical, the nurse came in to do all the pre-exam stuff prior to the doctor coming in. All questions were directed to my mother and not me. I could live with that, but when she was done she turned to my mother and said, "Strip him down to his underpants. The doctor will be right in."

I can still hear the words to this day. The fact that she said, "Strip him" and not even "undress him" or "have him undress" Even the subtle fact that she specified underpants and not even underwear as if to make sure my mother knew to take my socks and t-shirt off. And the word strip has some forceful connotations to it, like the nurse expected my mother to have to hold me down kicking and screaming to get my clothes off. I started to undress myself, but my mother came over to help me, pulling my shirt over my head and helping me get my shoes and pants off, almost as if she was afraid to disobey the nurses instruction to strip me down. I still think about that visit to this day.

Rt190: There may be a difference in this respect between France and your country. In France, one normally takes only very small children to a pediatrician. You tend to have to make an appointment quite in advance unless you have a true emergency. So a child of age 11 would generally be taken to a G.P., not a pediatrician.

Another difference is that in France, most G.P. and pediatrician are self-employed and do not work in big clinics. They may have a secretary but I have never heard of one employing a nurse.

OMG! I remember my mother sitting at the kitchen table with some of her friends, one was a nurse. I was 12 at the time and she was telling them how underdeveloped my penis was. She wanted their opinion on whether it was normal. I got called into the kitchen and I was told to take down my pants and boxers so the ladies could see my penis. I was totally embarrassed. One of the women commented "He's got hair down there, I guess the rest will grow in eventually."

OMG! I remember my mother sitting at the kitchen table with some of her friends, one was a nurse. I was 12 at the time and she was telling them how underdeveloped my penis was. She wanted their opinion on whether it was normal. I got called into the kitchen and I was told to take down my pants and boxers so the ladies could see my penis. I was totally embarrassed. One of the women commented "He's got hair down there, I guess the rest will grow in eventually."

Wow, all I can say is: 'I feel your embarrassment ...'

When bending over the receptionist's lap with pants down in my youth, she sometimes unnerved me by discussing with the doctor the shot she was about to see me get in my vulnerable bare bottom.

What doctor ever gave shots? It's a nurses job and we barely know how to do it.

Not all doctors have nurses in their employ. Our family doctor is self employed and doesn't even have a receptionist. He gives injections when necessary ... and is good at it. I never feel a thing. My parents family doctor also gave injections himself, that when making house calls no less.

From my experience, it's in hospitals or large clinics that nurses are employed and then possibly give injections.

It's a different situation outside the US.

I seem to remember that when something goes wrong because of an injection, it is ultimately the doctor who is legally responsible. But I'm not 100% sure right now. I would have to ask about the situation in Belgium.

Actually nurses in my ED carry their own malpractice insurance through the hospital. I personally know of a case where the nurse mistakenly gave insulin instead of lidocaine as a diluent to ceftriaxone. The child developed profound hypoglycemia and nearly died. He had a brain injury from it. Sadly he was the grandson of another nurse in the department. It was only possible to prove it by assaying the type of insulin. Her insurance paid not the docs.

. Her insurance paid not the docs.

Once someone is employed here, the employer is by law mandated to have the proper insurance for everyone. Employees do not need to insure themselves employers have to insure their employees. And unless gross negligence is proven, responsibility will will flow upwards.

Now I know that some hospitals here are run as a sort of co-op, with doctors and often religious orders owning a part and that therefore they are in essence self employed and therefore responsible for the insurance of their own employees.

Liquidsky: In France, most general practitioners and pediatricians are self-employed.. Sometimes they don't have their own secretary (G.P.'s at least) and take down their own appointments, sometimes they have a shared receptionist/secretary between several physicians who pool resources. I have NEVER seen any employing a nurse.

Recall that the costs have to be limited: the price of an appointment to a G.P., for an adult patient and no special case, is 23€ if the G.P. follows Social Security price. That's not a co-payment, that's the full price. On this amount, there is no money to pay for the army of clerical and nursing staff typical of US-style health care.

The only nurses that I've seen working with a doctor, outside hospitals and clinics, were in the organization that does my work physicals.

So in France, it was and is still common for a G.P. or pediatrician to prescribe a vaccine, then the parents would pick it up from a pharmacy, and they would see the doctor again for the injection. So G.P. and pediatricians actually do injections and must know how to do them.

The alternative is to go with the prescription to see a nurse in private practice (it's cheaper, but you don't really care if you have Social Security + private insurance for the co-payment). There are nurses who have a shared receptionist, you make an appointment, show them the prescription and give them the vaccine, and you get your injection.

Since I work in the hospital we use nurses. I have also worked in a private clinic and they used medical assistants. They have very little training and thus are much less expensive to employ. Honestly I feel a little bare working there. ER nurses are a tough lot and protect me all the time. I of course know how to give injections and do so frequently. It's not rocket science. Now placing a nice subclavian line is another story. Always fun.

Well my doctor doesn't employ nurses in his office either nor medical assistants. He goes and picks up his patients from the waiting room himself, does their vitals himself and yes, when and if they need an injection he does that as well. I have asked him more than a few times to hire me in his office because I could take a lot of the work load off of him and he could see more patients and in turn make more money. He always turns me down though because he says that he would go broke because all he would want to do is chase me around the exam table. And he knows me very well because I wouldn't run all that fast and would want to be caught. Then I would turn the tables on him and chase him till caught and the fun would start all over again, lol.

Mashie

I can't speak for other counties but a few points regarding the last series of comments:

In the US, Pediatricians tend to keep patients from 0 to sometimes as old as 21, but usually 16-18. My GP won't see anyone under 16. I can make a same day appointment with the pediatrician. The GP usually needs a day or three to get me in. Not bad actually, some need 5 to 7 and specialist need months. I am noticing more and more urgent care centers opening up to fill the gap between regular visits and the emergency room. These urgent care centers take both adults and children.

Our pediatrician employs Registered Nurses who can draw blood and give injections

My GP has a medical assistant. She can draw blood, but the doctor has to actually give the injections. I think because almost every pediatricians visit seems to end in shots, they employ RNs. With my GP only a few times to I need a shot. But I know of other smaller pediatrician offices where the doctors give the shots. So there is no universal rule here. It is what works best for the practice and office.

In the US some pharmacists are allowed to give some injections. What I find interesting is an adult can walk into a pharmacy and get a flu shot. If you are under 16 you can only get a flu shot from the pharmacy if you have a script from your doctor. I presume this is a liability thing again.

How insurance/liability works varies and with the US unfortunately being a very litigious society will usually try to everyone responsible. The doctor, the nurse, the practice (if it is group practice) the maker of the medication, the mailman for delivering the medication, etc. you get the idea.

Yes! I can relate real well to the Adults talking during a physical exam. Most of the talk was about positioning me, the Dr telling my Mom about the next part of the procedure ,the medication I would be getting, etc. Occasionally, there was the threat of immediate discipline if I did not cooperate. The 50s and 60s seemed to be "the Dark Ages" for child patients in the exam room. The old adage "Children should be seen and not heard." was live and well during this era. Daniel

My doctor as a child was a 60 something African American man. I remember one instance when I was 11 and taken to him for a checkup. I had been having serious constipation issues which my mother made sure to inform him of right away. He asked her how often I went, if I had struggled and what my stools look like. So humiliating! They proceeded to discuss my last toilet visit like they were discussing the weather all while I sat there on the exam table, red faced. Finally he turned to me and asked, "Does your boo-boo hurt?" I wanted to respond with something like, I'M 11 YEARS OLD NOT 3 YOU IDIOT, YOU CAN TALK TO ME LIKE A GROWN UP. But I just wanted it to be over... so all i said was "yes."

he turned to me and asked, "Does your boo-boo hurt?" I wanted to respond with something like, I'M 11 YEARS OLD NOT 3 YOU IDIOT, YOU CAN TALK TO ME LIKE A GROWN UP. But I just wanted it to be over... so all i said was "yes."

Too bad when you're still young and can't come up with a snappy answer to such inane talk ... I absolutely hated being talked to like that as a child ...