Does Punishment work on adults for changing bad bhavior?

I have on two different girlfriends that had developed two bad habits. One of them was smoking and the other was over spending / spending money on frivolous things. For example, $600 for two tickets to a concert. She wanted to get first rate seats. As it turns out, she did not even get to go to the concert.

I wanted to help them break their bad habits by punishing them. The punishment we choose was spanking. In the first case, that was the only punishment I could give. As time went by she continued to smoke and the spankings got harder. I also did not like dating somebody who smoked and she got tired of a sore bottom. As a result she dumped me.

In the second case, I could use both spankings and other punishments like essays which I did. However, she continued to over spend and my punishments were not getting the job done. At one point, she asked me for a gift of money and I refused. Our relationship went down hill and we broke up shortly afterwards. In part because she was rude to me. I would say it was a mutual breakup but it was more me than her.

In any case, I have found spanking my girlfriends to be a lot of fun but it has not been effective in changing behavior. Have you had positive experiences where punishment does change behavior?

Obviously in the two experiences you cited, spanking didn’t “fix” the behavior. Seems adult spankings are more of a sexual or fetish activity vs an effective tool to correct behavior. The spanked person may deliberately break the rules to feed their fetish.

No because it broadly doesn’t work in children either, it just teaches them not to get caught. And if you’re doing it to adults in a kink setting, it just makes them want to do the bad behavior more to get punished on purpose.

I was going to post something clever here but sorry, I just can't think of a witty reply that would not just point to the obvious. Punishing someone who enjoys it is positive reinforcement for bad behavior.

It reminds me of the anime shows Charger Girls and Bludgeoning Angel. If you have not seen them it is worth the time to watch them. Lots of Wholy fuck that's just so crazy moments. More so with Bludgeoning Angel.

And if you’re doing it to adults in a kink setting, it just makes them want to do the bad behavior more to get punished on purpose.

That is why the punishment has to be an actual punishment, not something that turns them on.

Restrictions - no sitting, clothes, specific foods (you can eat them in front of them),

Boring repetitive activities - dusting using a Q-tip or toothbrush, hauling something somewhere one small piece at a time (laundry - folded and put away one piece at a time), groceries put away one can at a time, put pasta in the container one piece at a time. Can be supplemented with other punishment(s) to distract and make them not do well to continue the punishment and get the point across.

Enema, suppositories.

You get the idea to think on.

Until five years ago when sadly she passed my aunt (not a real aunt - no relation) would punish me with enemas or a strapon fucking, often in front of her friend who would watch just to add humiliation to the mix. This would be for things like getting caught masturbating over her lingerie, using her sex toys without permission or viewing porn on her laptop. Did it stop this naughty nephew from misbehaving? Nope ! 😃

MissStress,

I wanted to use food restriction as punishment however, my girlfriend said that it was not within her limits citing health concerns. That is, she wanted to eat healthy and therefore she would not want to give up any food. My response was that food restriction would be something like no alcohol, no soda and/or no sweets. But the answer remained no.

I don’t thinks it’s as simple as saying “it’s just a fetish, it doesn’t even work on kids” etc. It really does just depend on the individual and what their intention is going into the situation. I mean, there is an entire industry of professional disciplinarians who solely deal with this kind of thing. While I’m sure there is a fraction of people who see them because it is sexually stimulating for them, I can say from experience for many it really is about behavior modification. For some people, it’s purely sexual. For others, it’s purely about behavior, and for some it’s a mixture of both. People may have their opinions about the psychology involved in someone especially in the latter category, but we are all unique individuals with unique experiences and backgrounds. I don’t know that it makes sense to apply broad statements here.

In @BobFromNJ ’s case it sounds to me like these girls probably never had any intention of changing their habits anyway, and likely saw the experience as purely sexual or as just going along with something he wanted to do. In my personal experience, if the other person never mentions these sorts of subjects on their own, and doesn't explode with joy the first time you bring up the idea, then there is a good chance they will never understand and will eventually resent you for it if they agree to try it out, particularly if they aren’t very good about setting boundaries or communicating.

Spanking and corporal punishment has always worked on me in terms of behavior modification, both as a kid and now as an adult. Even though there is certainly an element of it that I find very exciting, it has never really been something I seek out purely for sexual gratification. If I am actually being punished for something, I go into it with the mindset and intention of improving my behavior and doing some honest self-reflection. We also never conclude a punishment with sex.

Are you referring to “fantasy “ punishments, or behavioral changes? You can’t “ground “ an adult for bad behavior, and a psychologist can’t fix defiant behavior.

@JJM No, I’m referring to something like real “domestic discipline”, or the many real, professional disciplinarians that offer such services outside of any sexual or BDSM context. I assure you, you can ground an adult for bad behavior IF they are willing to participate in such a thing.

Just because these things are rare does not mean they don’t exist.

I once asked a therapist, “Do I need to have my behavior corrected?”

Luckily she had a solid wooden straight backed chair.

She grabbed it then had me approach her as she sat on it. She ordered me, “Unzip your pants and let them drop!”

I did, then she grabbed my arm and pulled me over to her, putting me over her thighs. She released my arm which along with my other, went to the floor to support me hanging across her lap.

I felt her hand slip under the waistband of my tighty whites. She forcefully yanked them down, baring my buttocks.

Then it started. Repeated high lifted hand, brought down firmly and literally “ soundly” on my milky white buttocks!

I forget when I stopped counting the hits. I do remember too, the hits were coming faster and faster. My buttocks were stinging and now sore as she continued spanking me.

She wasn’t big on conversation , but did admonish me, saying, “You’re getting corrected and Yes You need correcting!”

When she finally stopped. She had me stand up. She got off the chair and told me to stand and bend over the back of the chair and took a picture of my “ corrected behavior”, my bottom. Crimson !

Depends on the context but in most cases unlikely, as for the most part it's going to be consensual on some level and so involves something the person in need of punishment wants or gets something out of, so not much deterrent. The deterrent aspect comes from wanting to avoid something, which is not going to be easily achieved in an adult scenario.

I think the only times a punishment has felt genuine to me as an adult is if there's an element of it that I'm not keen on but felt that there was a genuine need to be punished.

I don't think so. Any punishment of an adult can only be done with consent of the adult. It only works on children because they don't have or don't know they have any alternative (in a family, for instance). Any child who calls the authorities on a parent finds out that CFS backs the parent, or else removes them from the home to be placed elsewhere (foster placement?) which they find to be even less tolerable.

An adult will only consent if they derive some perceived advantage (fetish, etc.) from the activity. When they perceive that to have ceased, they will withhold permission, usually by leaving the relationship, as indicated in the post by bobinnj below.

I once had a female mentee who asked me to spank her to correct her behavior. We started with emails and messages in which she would tell me what she did or planned todo, and I would give her advice and reminders of consequences, such as "spank, spank." She seemed to appreciate the feedback. Then one day she ghosted me and that was that. We never met in person. She withdrew her consent.

If you’re truly using spanking to punish an adult, you do it without consent and without a safe word. The degree of punishment is solely up to the punisher. It could legally be called assault.

If it’s in a BDSM scene or relationship, it’s different, it’s controlled, safe and with consent and limits.

While punishment can discourage unwanted adult behavior, it's often more effective when combined with positive reinforcement and doesn't always teach positive alternatives.

When punishment occurs close in time to the undesirable behavior, is applied every time the behavior occurs, and is proportionate to the severity of the behavior, it's more likely to be effective. For me it hand and hairbrush for bad behaviour but when it is severe then the dreaded cane hanging behind the door will be added.

Positive reinforcement can create a positive learning environment, where individuals feel safe and motivated. It important that I must understand why my punishment spankings is for and source of positive reminders to behave especially when I try to sit down after the spanking.

@rigel

If you’re truly using spanking to punish an adult, you do it without consent and without a safe word. The degree of punishment is solely up to the punisher. It could legally be called assault.

I know everyone has their own opinion on this topic, so let me put a disclaimer before I start my post: Safe words are absolutely essential for BDSM play and you should have one.

That being said, in my domestic discipline dynamic we do not have one. We have a contract that outlines what I have consented to, and states that I give my girlfriend full authority over my discipline using the punishments we have specified in that document. As to the legal question of whether or not that would hold up in a court if we somehow found ourselves in one? I have no idea, but we both came into this relationship looking for complimentary things and this type of dynamic was one of them. We have an immense amount of trust and communication with each other and I can revoke my consent whenever I want to, but I have never wanted to and I’m confident I never will. If I ever thought a punishment was too harsh, I have a right to speak my mind after the fact, but I have never felt the need to do that either. Our BDSM play time is entirely separate from our dynamic and that does include a safe word.

I understand the points people have made in this thread that seem to point to the idea that “punishment” in general cannot actually be a real thing within a relationship or dynamic because your consent negates the element of being out of control. I would just reiterate that just because it may be rare, does not mean it does not occur. Intention is an important factor and adults do possess agency. I feel like trying to make a philosophical or semantic rule about this is kindof silly when everyone has unique experiences with these things. It is entirely possible for some individuals to genuinely want structure brought into their lives with things like corporal punishment while deriving zero pleasure from it as an experience.

There also seems to be some back and forth both in our communities and in the vanilla world about whether or not spankos find things like DD dynamics in order to “live” the fetish as immersively as they can, in a similar vein to 24/7 BDSM dynamics. I think that’s largely going to depend on the individuals and the notion could feel invalidating for some, but I think it would be important to note that the notion of a safe word can and will break that immersion for certain people if that is the case. I don’t consider myself one of these people for the record, and I don’t think this applies to all spankos either. Just something to note. I think it’s very wise that we all acknowledge the importance of a safe word, but some people will not use them for a variety of reasons and it’s okay to let them be if they are that comfortable with each other and no one is being taken advantage of.

I would definitely say yes but it must be consensual and done in a loving way with encouragement to do better in the future be it bad behavior, bad attitude, disobedience, etc. In our case it almost alway leads to a fantastic feeling of closeness and intimacy with one another ( a different way of saying great sex in case of any confustion to the reader. lol). Denise

A big NO for me as an adult punishment do not change my bad behaviour at all.

Punishment looks backwards at what you did wrong, and exacts justice. Discipline looks forward to who you want to become, and helps you get there.

I was given punishment and even sometimes I don’t even know what I did wrong to get the spanking and many a time I felt I do not deserve the punishment at all.

When I have a discipline spanking I am told what I did wrong and why I deserve to be spanked. It helps me to think how badly I have behaved and to reflect not to do it again.